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Views On The Death Penalty

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Posted by: alexx

If Capital Punishment Is The Right Thing To Do When Some One Takes Anothers Life...why Didnt God Kill Cain....id Like Some Feedback On This Because It Has Always Been In My Mind


Posted by: kasi64

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexx
If Capital Punishment Is The Right Thing To Do When Some One Takes Anothers Life...why Didnt God Kill Cain....id Like Some Feedback On This Because It Has Always Been In My Mind




this is a good question!! with the murder of this child in florida it has been discussed between my hubby and i. he would like to have 10 minutes with this man. i have mixed feelings on the death penalty because on one hand i am like most people i want revenge but GOD says revenge is his. Killing him will not bring this child back and i dont think the death penalty keeps others from committing these crimes. but if it was my baby, i dont know


Posted by: czynka

God created life, and it is only He who has the right to end it.
I think it is not up to man to decide another man's fate, regardless of what he has done. Personally i think being locked away in jail with no distraction from your thoughts and the deed you have committed can be overwhelming if youre confronted with it in this way, every day of your life. Of course there are those who show no remorse at all, but just think of all the prisoners who have come to know Jesus as a result of being jailed...if they had received the death sentence, then their souls would have been lost forever.
It is an enormous thing to ask of us, to forgive if one of our loved ones is taken or hurt by someone...but that is what the Lord asks of us... oh Lord God protect our loved ones that we will never be placed in that position.
How would we ever handle that? The Lord asks us to love our neighbour as we love ourselves.....love...the greatest of all three, faith, hope and love..... to forgive and love....somehow i believe He would give us the strength.


Posted by: alexx

I, Too, Feel The Same Way. Myself Alone...my Flesh...would Want To Absolutely Kill Someone Who Has Hurt A Child....but The Mercy Of God Is Much Greater And Just...god Knows What Satan Has Done In A Persons Life To Destroy It.....and God Is The Only Fair Judge Of A Mans Life


Posted by: jedijeb

Well I know this view is not what most like to hear, but there are places in the Bible where God's own laws point to using the death penilty. Also there are times when He ordered the complete destruction of countries at the hand of His people. We also can not say that it is not up to man to decide another man's fate, because Judges and Rulers are put in place by God, where many of those Judges and Rulers fail though is not turning to God for their direction. I know many will point to the woman caught in adultry and brought before Jesus as saying He didn't consider the death penilty any longer in effect, but if that is so, then why did He allow the two thieves do die with Him at His crusifiction?

I hope I never have to sit on a jury that has to decide a death penilty case, but if I do I will do it with the leading of the Holy Spirit.

If we ask why didn't God kill Cain for his crime, then we also have to ask why did God destroy the whole world except for Noah and his family and later why He destroyed Sodom and Gamorah. Our ways are not God's ways and our thoughts are not God's thoughts, and God has always been a God of love and mercy, but also a God of justice and at times wrath. We cannot say the death penilty is wrong because to do so is to say that God's laws are wrong. But in all things we are to seek the guidance of the Holy Spirit to know what is appropriate at any given time, and for everything there is a time that it is appropriate and a time that it isn't.


Posted by: markmarkmark

Where in the New Testament does Jesus approve of capital punishment?
When did He tell the disciples to cast the first stone? Wasn't Jesus Himself executed? If we follow the Innocent Victim of capital punishment, how can we support the death penalty?


Posted by: jedijeb

Quote:
Originally Posted by markmarkmark
Where in the New Testament does Jesus approve of capital punishment?
When did He tell the disciples to cast the first stone? Wasn't Jesus Himself executed? If we follow the Innocent Victim of capital punishment, how can we support the death penalty?


You answered that question, we follow the INNOCENT victim of capital punishment. Jesus was innocent and died for our sins, but listen to what the thief said right there beside Jesus.

Luk 23:39 And one of the malefactors that were hanged railed on him, saying, Art not thou the Christ? save thyself and us.
Luk 23:40 But the other answered, and rebuking him said, Dost thou not even fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation?
Luk 23:41 And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss.
Luk 23:42 And he said, Jesus, remember me when thou comest in thy kingdom.
Luk 23:43 And he said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To-day shalt thou be with me in Paradise.

Why did Jesus not deliver that man right there from the cross after he had accepted Him as his savior? That man said he was guilty and deserved to die and Jesus didn't say he was wrong. When we repent and accept Jesus as our Lord and Savior we are forgiven of our sins, but there are consequences which will remain. The consequences of this man were death on that cross, but Jesus did bring to him salvation, and a reward for his faith of eternal life, but the man still had to face the death which his sin had wrought.

Mal 3:5 And I will come near to you to judgment; and I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, and against the adulterers, and against the false swearers, and against those that oppress the hireling in his wages, the widow, and the fatherless, and that turn aside the sojourner from his right, and fear not me, saith Jehovah of hosts.
Mal 3:6 For I, Jehovah, change not; therefore ye, O sons of Jacob, are not consumed.
Mal 3:7 From the days of your fathers ye have turned aside from mine ordinances, and have not kept them. Return unto me, and I will return unto you, saith Jehovah of hosts. But ye say, Wherein shall we return?
Mal 3:8 Will a man rob God? yet ye rob me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings.
Mal 3:9 Ye are cursed with the curse; for ye rob me, even this whole nation.
Mal 3:10 Bring ye the whole tithe into the store-house, that there may be food in my house, and prove me now herewith, saith Jehovah of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.


And while I agree I have never read where Jesus told anyone to cast the first stone and in this instance God was the taker of the life, it really is an example of capital punishment for lieing to the Holy Spirit and it shows that we are still to obey God's laws and if not we will reap the punishment, and God judges with a just judgement and knows what our response will be before we even commit the crime and our punishment will be fitting.

Act 5:1 But a certain man named Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a possession,
Act 5:2 and kept back part of the price, his wife also being privy to it, and brought a certain part, and laid it at the apostles' feet.
Act 5:3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thy heart to lie to the Holy Spirit, and to keep back part of the price of the land?
Act 5:4 While it remained, did it not remain thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thy power? How is it that thou hast conceived this thing in thy heart? thou has not lied unto men, but unto God.
Act 5:5 And Ananias hearing these words fell down and gave up the ghost: and great fear came upon all that heard it.

Jesus also used an illustration of man's judgement and justice as a parallel to the judgment and justice of God,

Luk 12:57 And why even of yourselves judge ye not what is right?
Luk 12:58 For as thou art going with thine adversary before the magistrate, on the way give diligence to be quit of him; lest haply he drag thee unto the judge, and the judge shall deliver thee to the officer, and the officer shall cast thee into prison.
Luk 12:59 I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou have paid the very last mite.

Here Jesus shows us that unless we work out our wrongs before the final judgment we will be doomed. If we commit sin and do not repent and come to Him for salvation we are doomed to an eternity in hell, likewise when we commit earthly crimes we are obliged to accept the consequences. If mercy is sought and it is found just to grant it, then we may be spared the total punishment, just as with salvation, if we seek it and we are true in our belief in Him we will receive salvation, but if we do not truely accept Him then we will still be lost.

Also Jesus never said He did away with capital punishment, otherwise He would have said the the old law was no more.

Mat 5:17 Think not that I came to destroy the law or the prophets: I came not to destroy, but to fulfil.
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass away from the law, till all things be accomplished.
Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, that except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no wise enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:21 Ye have heard that it was said to them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
Mat 5:22 but I say unto you, that every one who is angry with his brother shall be in danger of the judgment; and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council; and whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of the hell of fire.

I have seen reports of testimony of men on death row who have accepted Christ, many do not say they believe their sentence should be overturned, but as with the theif on the cross, say they deserve their fate. But they give thanks to Jesus that they will be with Him in eternity and let their public witness be a warning to those who would consider following the same path they followed before they knew Christ. I struggled with this for a long time when I was first saved, but I have learned that God's wisdom is far beyond my own and I accept the things which He has put forth even when I may not agree with them, because I know He is right. I am still learning and even here I know I am not completely right, but I will let the Holy Spirit guide me as I seek more truth in this and all things.


Posted by: czynka

But God's thoughts are not our thoughts, we cannot even begin to fathom how He thinks. And what about ...Thou shalt not kill ????


Posted by: jedijeb

I don't have my concordance in front of me here at work but I remember that the reference to kill in the commandment " thou shalt not kill " is Thou shalt not commit murder. There is a distinction between killing and murder. If there was no distinction then when God put forth the law that someone should be stoned to death for committing adultry then He would have been asking people to commit sin, also when He commanded the Isrealite armys into battle He would have been asking them to commit sin. God does not sin and He does not ask anyone to sin.

God gave us laws and punishments for breaking those laws. He also gave us mercy and wisdom. He didn't just give us these things for the punishment of those who break the laws, but also for the protection of everyone else around us. Think of the story of Achin ( I think that is right) who took a few garments and a few bars of silver when the Isrealite army destroyed a city. God had commanded that everything be burned from that city but he took a few things and hid them in his tent. In the next battle many of thier soldiers died because God was not with them in battle because of the sin in the camp. When it was discovered what had happened God had Joshua put not only Achin but his family to death. This seems drastic and does not seem to sync with the main question of the thread about Cain where God had mercy on Cain. I don't claim to know what the difference was, but I believe that Joshua did not sin in carrying out the sentence.

When Jesus came He did not do away with the law, He transformed it from something written in books to something written in our hearts. When we are saved we know when we sin through the conviction of the Holy Spirit not from a head knowledge of every written law. Jesus made the law what is was always meant to be, something we obeyed out of our love for Him and not of our fear of judgement. The punishment for all sin is death, and we will all die if Jesus does not come again before our time is up. The punishment for gossip is the same as for murder in the end, death will come to us all because of sin. We can however avoid the second death and have our soul live forever with Christ if we accept Him as our savior.

In the end we must let the Holy Spirit guide us. Our feelings are not what should lead us because our feelings can be wrong. I may not like the fact that divorce can keep someone from remarrying without it being adultry, even it they are the nicest person in the world, but Jesus himself said that only in the case of fornication of the other partner is that person allowed to divorce and remarry. Many would say that if God loves us He will overlook that so that we may be happy, but if we go that far where do we stop. Should we expect God to overlook those who don't accept Jesus as savior and let them into Heaven in the end also? We can not throw out any part of God's laws because they seem to not come from love, for what do we truely know of the depths of His love. Maybe God loves the next victim so much that He allows the murderer to be put to death to spare that next victim? Like I said, I don't know God's thinking but that is something to consider. Also if we are the one who let's a murderer go free and he murders again, are we held responsible for that death, of what if we decide to lock him up for life and he murders someone in prison, are we responsible? I would say we are responsible if we were not following the guidance of the Holy Spirit in the decision, if we did as the Holy Spirit guided us to do then we are free of the responsibility. There are so many facets to this question I would really like to know more about it from some who are more knowledgable of the scriptures. But there are some questions to ponder.


Posted by: alynelleu

For those that keep stating that "thou should not kill" are you against the military? I also believe that it means murder. There are a lot of Christian soldiers out there fighting for what they believe is right, what God is leading them to do, yet they do end up "killing" not "murdering".


Posted by: kasi64

Quote:
Originally Posted by alynelleu
For those that keep stating that "thou should not kill" are you against the military? I also believe that it means murder. There are a lot of Christian soldiers out there fighting for what they believe is right, what God is leading them to do, yet they do end up "killing" not "murdering".





good point!!


Posted by: charity4jesus

The death penalty is a subject that always gets me all emotional b/c i've known people who have been murdered out of cold blood. and the images of the bloody body bags being pulled out of their home stayed with me since i was 9 years old.
i have prayed about this issue many times and God always tells me that those who murder, rape, sodomize, canibilize, etc. innocent people are owned by the devil and there for should be sent back to hell where they belong ASAP. These types of people destroy lives and bring people away from God. When i was 9 i believed in God until i saw that the man that murdered my mothers friend and her son was sitting alive in a jail cell while they were dead and the father/husband was left with the images of walking into a quiet house with his wife with her head blown off laying over her only sons dead body. the murderer even killed the family dog. Put yourself in that mans shoes. imagine if that was your family? Justice under God should be done. This murderer's life is just but a momment in the great span of things. Let the man/woman never have another momment again. they blew their chance. let them rott in hell.