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Fallen Angels

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Posted by: Illuminate

Good morning everyone,

Lately I have been pondering on what happened to the Fallen Angels that were cast out from Heaven? For some odd reason a friend and I were questioning, whatever happened to the fallen angels, where do they hide, in what do they hide, can they sneak inside our homes and how, are they here amongst us, in spirit, whispering sweet nothings to us? I would be very interested and grateful for anyone's feedback on this, or insight.

Thank you all in advance and have a blessed weekend.

Lorena


Posted by: eagle4him

2 Peter 2:4

For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to pits of darkness, reserved for judgment...


Posted by: Illuminate

Quote:
Originally Posted by eagle4him
2 Peter 2:4

For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to pits of darkness, reserved for judgment...


Hello eagle4him, thank you for responding. If it isn't asking for too much, can you please share Old Test scriptures on this subject? I would grately appreciate it.

Thank you in advance and have a blessed day,

Lorena


Posted by: Christian Commando

Illuminate-

eagle4hm has a good one, but realize, these angels who went against God are not in Hell itself as yet, but a symbolic Hell right now. How is that?

Jude 1:6- "And the angels which kept not thier first estate, but left thier own habitation, He hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness-(bound by thier sin), unto the judgement of the great day".

As you can see in this Scripture, there was apparently a war as such the first time around when Lucifer convinced 1/3 rd of Heavens Amgels- (Rev. 12:4), to follow him to try and take over rule of all creation.

But they lost and thus, left their original homes in God's Domain Jude 1:6, "3rd Heven"-II Cor. 12:2, to live in the 1st and 2nd Heavens- (1st- Gen. 1:8- firmament and earth, 2nd-celestial Heven- II Chr. 2:6- (8064- region above the earth; the heavens;place of the stars).

Now, as seen in one of the oldest Prophecies of where satan will end up during the Tribulation Period, consider Rev. 12:7-10,12-13, then go back to Ezek. 28:18-19, and Isa.14:12-17, yu'll find Lucifer and his hordes will be cast fully out of all Heavens, to the earth, thus will be thier last "horah" if you will, to have rule over anything at all, before te antichrist and false prophet are cast into Hell and satan into the bottomless pit- Rev. 19:19- 20:3.

Thus, as of right now, satan and his demons are freely roaming the 1st and 2nd Heavens- firmament and celestial, being able to visit and fully interact with this physical world.

Let us realize, this physical world was created secondary- (Gen. 1:1- order of creation), after Heaven. Therefore, this physical world exists in the same time and space as the Heavens, but at a different level somehow, where boundaries are kept to seperate the two, at least from the physical direction.

But, I believe God and Angels can see directly into the physical world from Heaven, without any restriction-(Rev.6:9-11), where we cannot do so from physical to spiritual, for as Paul declares, we view into the spiritual thru a tinted glass. The veil seperating our worlds is thin enough, we can experience temporary moments of peering into the spiritual, but as see with spirits possessing people Jesus had come across, not to mention all the Angelic visitations of God's Angels to people thru out His Word, its quite clear the spirit realm beings are not contained and limited by these physical boundaries tat limit us here in the physical.

God Bless!!


Posted by: eagle4him

I was waiting for this CC. I have heard a lot of preaching on the fallen angels now are the demons. This I do not believe is accurate. First of all I believe that these fallen angels are actually either in hell itself or bound in a dimension I cannot explain. However, they are not now roaming the earth. This brings up the question, then of where did the demons come from? I think in order to satisfy the question of where are the fallen angels we must also study where the demons came from.

Genesis 6:4
The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men, and they bore children to them. Those were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown.

Numbers 13:33
"There also we saw the Nephilim (the sons of Anak are part of the Nephilim); and we became like grasshoppers in our own sight, and so we were in their sight."

I believe the demons that now roam the earth are the offspring of the fallen angels mating with humans prior to being put in chains, thrown into hell or wherever they are.


Posted by: Christian Commando

eagle4him-

Quite correct in assuming about Nephilium, as I've learned that as well, but, you'll find in Job where the "sons of God" are Angels, but in Noah's day, Early Church Teachings, along with the Jewish Encyclopedia Judaica, refers to them as "fallen angels- of which the Biblical definition is, fallen ones, evil ones, principalities of darkness, demons, demonic spirits, satanic spirits, etc.

Secondly- if true, then Christ was not casting demons out of people possessed in God's Word-(Word devils, demons, etc Christ used in those references all mean the same thing- fallen ones, fallen Angels,etc) , including the "Legion" of demons out of the one in particular. I suggest you rethink this over again how you believe, as I've also seen demons appearing as dead people in places people called- "haunted" plus other points.

I suggest a good Book for you to read is called- "This present darkness". It shows the same precepts I believe of satan and his demons. Besides, if they are all locked in Hell, how is it satan could've been the serpent in the Garden of Eden-(God calls satan- "that old serpent, the devil", in Revelation), to decieve Eve? Impossible. Or be loose to be on earth with Christ to tempt Him? Impossible if locked up.

God Bless!!


Posted by: eagle4him

I know that there are demons--no argument there, the question is where did they come from and are they the same as the fallen angels?


Posted by: Christian Commando

Hehe, editing my post when you posted. Did you read the definitions I gave from the concordance, Bible Dictionary etc?

Remember, God calls Lucifer- (Fallen Angel), satan, the devil, that old serpent, Great Red Dragon, etc. How much more proof does anyone need, when definition of "devil" is satan, satanic spirit, demon, demonic spirit, plus more.

And remember as well, as noted above, satan can appear in any form he likes, as can his followers- serpent, Great Red Dragon, a devil, demon, "Diabolis"- (means "the devil-satan, in human flesh"), plus more from God's Word.

There is no question who demons are or where they come from. Its clearly Biblically shown.

Ok, proof- "demon- see devil-devils"- Matt. 4:1,5,8,11- Greek- 1228- "diabolis"- devilish, malicious, slanderous, as a noun, the devil, Satan, or a wicked person who is like the devil:- devil (35), false accusers,(2), slanderers(1).

God Bless!!


Posted by: eagle4him

There are demons, devils, thrones, principalities, rulers in dark places. There are also princes, legions, etc.

Some have more power than others, some more territory than others. Oh yeah, there is definitely rank and file in the spirit world.


Posted by: Christian Commando

eagle4him-

Correct,but forgive me, what does that have to do with where they come from, or who they are?

God Bless!!


Posted by: Illuminate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Christian Commando
eagle4him-

It shows the same precepts I believe of satan and his demons. Besides, if they are all locked in Hell, how is it satan could've been the serpent in the Garden of Eden-(God calls satan- "that old serpent, the devil", in Revelation), to decieve Eve? Impossible. Or be loose to be on earth with Christ to tempt Him? Impossible if locked up.

God Bless!!



Good points, Christian Commando.

Thank you both for sharing.

God bless you~

Illuminate


Posted by: peapod

Good call on Frank Peretti!!!!!!!


Posted by: Christian Commando

Frank Peret??

Since I have no TV stations and hear very little radio, you'll have to enlighten me on that one.

God Bless!!


Posted by: Praying Gal

Illuminate - Just a thought, you might want to check out what the book of Enoch says. You can read it online, or even a synopsis of it.

This book is mentioned as authoritative in the "New" Testament. But where did it go? It is not included in our current Bibles. However, the Ethiopian Christians had a copy of it. Then it was discovered with the Dead Sea manuscripts, too. I personally think it is authentic. It sounds far fetched often, but then if we had never heard of the Resurrection, Joshua's long day, and so much else from the Bible, how credible would those things sound to us? You can make up your own mind, of course, but the book of Enoch definitely presents answers to some of your questions.


Posted by: Christian Commando

Praying Gal-

I realize you are offering help but-

All be it this- "Book of Enoch" may appear to be considered by Early Church Leaders of the first 3 Centuries as authentic and they spoke references from it, know this, there is no mention of scritural references by the Apostles from this "Book", as they made Scriptural References to other Old Test. Books.

Secondly- There is more afirmation accepted that these writings- "Book of Parables" its also called, had actually been written by another person using a Biblical Charactor's name-(as they called it- pseudepigrapha), to claim authenticity of the writings.

Third- By the major meeting at Laodicea for christians, this "Book" had been rejected and banned, also removed from the earliest formed "Canon of Scripture".

Fourth- Just like the "Apo****ha Books", the "Book of Enoch" at this point, cannot be considered as truely inspired by God, until undoubtable proof can be established of it being "God inspired", collected and preserved, among at least two more points used in adopting writings into the Biblical "Canon of Scripture".

fifth- There are some discreancies well known in these writings that make it questionable- Here are just 3 of them-

1- Supposedly Enoch speaks of there being 7 Heavens, when I show the clear Scriptural references in my first post here, of God speaking of only 3 referenced.

2- This Book also claims that God created souls of men before creating the foundation of the earth. WRONG- Job. 38:4- "Where wast thou, when I laid the foundations of the earth"? And Gen. 1:1- creating Heaven and earth and Gen. 1:26-27, where God finally creates the spirits of Adm and Eve, during the 6st day of creation.

3- Its been proven that at only part of the time, does the Book of Enoch in its ethical teachings, parallel those of the New Test or Proverbs.

I will neither speak against its worthiness nor for it without more imputable proof one way or the other. I suggest tho, it best to leave questionable teachings such as this out of references to others until such proof can be established either way.

It would not be good practice to suggest questionable writings we consider as Godly, from information that is clearly skeptical at best at this point.

God Bless!!


Posted by: MamaCat

Quote:
Originally Posted by Christian Commando
I suggest a good Book for you to read is called- "This present darkness". It shows the same precepts I believe of satan and his demons. Besides, if they are all locked in Hell, how is it satan could've been the serpent in the Garden of Eden-(God calls satan- "that old serpent, the devil", in Revelation), to decieve Eve? Impossible. Or be loose to be on earth with Christ to tempt Him? Impossible if locked up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Christian Commando
Frank Peret??

Since I have no TV stations and hear very little radio, you'll have to enlighten me on that one.

God Bless!!

Frank Perretti, Christian author, THIS PRESENT DARKNESS, one of many fictional books that deal with demons and the spiritual warfare, ... and other terrific books!!


Posted by: Christian Commando

aaaahhh, ok, you'll have to forgive me, I remembered the book from back when got it and read it, but been long enough, I'd forgotten who wrote it hehe. Have to dig it out and look up author's name again.

Thanks Sis in Christ!! Till I get my ow place again and can set up my literature again, its all in boxes right now, most any ways except what use here hehe.

God bless!!


Posted by: Christian Commando

I just wanted to add this discussion point, to the responce I gave about the "Book of Enoch".

Some people have claimed Prov. 8:22-31, is claiming the person speaking here says that God claims he- ( the man) or his spirit, was created before the foundation of the earth. This is wrong. Jesus Christ speaks prophetically thru this man of His own- (Jesus') situation and position in Heaven. vs- 4, 6-8, 10,13-22.

As you can see, Christ continually in the above scriptures refer to Himself and what people need to do to follow Him.

So... how is it, from 22-31, people get the idea, the man is lead to claim it was his spirit, not Christ Himself, as being spoken of here? Its clear, even into 23, Jesus is still speaking of Himself.

But, Jesus in declaring "I was set up from evelasting", is not claiming He was "created", but put into a level of responcibility even before the earth was made.

"set up" does not mean "created", but given responcibility- (level of authority- 15-16, also Dan. 2:21)

25- "before the hills was I brought forth"- (included in the creation process). WHAT?

God declares- That all things were created by Him thru the Son- Ephes. 3:9. "brought forth"- (called, set into position, included, involved with, etc).

27- "When He- (God), prepared the Heavens, I was there"- (Jesus, not a man's spirit).

30- "Then I was by Him, as one brought up with Him;"- (Jesus was with God all thru the creation of all things).

31- "and My delights were with the son's of men." (Men being thankful and enjoying the earthly life God had blessed them with, enjoying the incredible physical creations existing around them.)

From 32 on, Jesus clearly shows once more, how we are to listen to Him and follow His leading and instruction.

Only God knows how people can turn such things around to claim it was man, Jesus spoke of as being around before the foundations of the earth were laid- (Job 38:4-7- "Where were you...").

Honestly people, would God ask Job this, if Job could say- "well, what about Prov. 8:22-30 where you claim we were around before that time, besides your telling us in Gen. 1:26-28 you didn't "create" our spirit-souls" until the fifth day of physical creation?"

See the confusion? Really there is none. Jesus is speaking thru this man, of Himself and His position in the Trinity concerning the process of "creation" of all things. It never speaks at all of any man's spirit being created by God before all that creation was started.

Now, newer versions of God's Word have mistakenly claimed it is "man's spirits" that were "created" before any creation was done by God thru these scriptures. And the newer "Concordances" for them concur with thst interpretation.

But, the older versions of the KJV before the 1611 version, all show in the Concordance I have dating back before 1950, the original Hebrew was refering to Christ, not man's spirit being around all that time.

God Bless!!


Posted by: Samuel_W

I have been hearing alot about the nephilim lately. Are they the fallen angels themseves or are they the offspring of the fallen angels and humans? and if they are they offspring of angels and humans what happened to them? wiped off the earth in the great flood perhaps? or do they still exist?


Posted by: Christian Commando

Hi Bro-

Question 1- Are Nephilium the fallen Angels or Offspring of them?

The offspring of them. The reason the word "giants" was used to replace "Nephilium" in Gen. 6:4 and Numbers 13:33 is, in later centuries, the newer generations of Christians could not accept the belief Angles- (fallen ones at that), would appear in physical form and marry earthly women and copulate with them to produce such an offspring.

But, Truth be known, older Bibles, before the 1611 KJV of the bible, shows the word "Nephilium" word used. By Hebrew translation, it comes from the root word- "Nephal", which translated means- "fallen ones, evil ones, evil spirits, demons, demonic spirits, Satan,..." etc.

Not only do the Early Church Leaders of the 1st 4 centuries of Christinity believe the "Son's of God" were Angelic Beings, but that the "Nephilium" were the result of the union between spirit beings and earthly women.

Question 2- Are they wiped off the earth or do they still exist?

Good question. The great flood happened before Numbers was written. Thus, they had to have survived, because in Num. 13:33 the reference is used again- "giants", originally was "Nephilium".

Where are they now or what are they doing? I know this will sound pretty outlandish, but, the "proof is in the pudding".

UFO occupants I believe are these "Nephilium". Why? Look at the documented evidence-

1- UFO's are documented as not being effected at all by our military weaponry fired upon them.

2- UFO's can out maneuver and out run all known man made air craft.

3- Documented proof shows they can appear and disappear on radar at will. And its not a shield, as documented proof from fighter pilots sent up to check them out state the UFO's were there, but disappear as they get close.

4- the US and other affiliated Governments with astronauts going in orbital space trips or to the Space Station, have all recieved messages from most if not all space trips man has made into space, that UFOs were following them or manuevering around them while orbiting the earth.

5- General MacArthur during WW II, recieved so many reports of UFO sightings and activities during air raids, bombings and more, that he wrote (if remember correctly), a report that went over 1,000 pages long to the Pentagon and this was his concensis of the study of those reports- He believed, one day, there would be a 3rd World War. And that war, would not be found just between earthly entities, but a race from outerspace as well.

6- There are thousands of UFO reports to the Government, relating to spiritual activities these creatures operating them have done. For example-

A- Reports of them giving messages to people, Jesus Christ was not God, but that His appearing, teachings and miracles were taken all wrong. In reality, Jesus was just a man, who had realized his potential to become a god himself and was really teaching that.

B- Vehicles electrically stop operating when UFOs are in close proximity.

C- When they have come close to homes, (Amityville Horror- based on true story for one), spiritual things have happened, screws unscrewed, chairs have moved across floors, lights go on and off, voices and noises heard in those homes, doors open and close, plus alot more.

D- Most of the ancient Cults to many of the newer ones, are focused on the human being. Look at Noah's Day and the partying and perverse activities between people that went on.

Documentations of personal contacts with these beings, have produced hundreds of reports of human body experiements, studying and checking them out in all aspects. (Alot related to the gender organs of reproduction). Psychological problems, telepathy as we call it used constantly.

People acting strange or having mental break downs after those contacts. Things done to thier bodies.

E- The activities all seen within those reports, are all akin to ancient demonic activities documented from centuries past.

to list a few

7- There are several major Christian Leaders who follow the Teachings of Early Church Leaders and believe now, because of what happened in Noah's Day concerning those "Son's of God" appearing on earth, it will happen again, but thru the "Nephilium"- offspring of that union back then.

At first, I seriously questioned this myself, until investigated Early church Teachings on Noah's Day and Num. 13:33, plus UFO and witch and witchcraft accts, and historical accts of demonic activity, hypnosis, psychics, clairvouyants plus more, up to a few years back. It all fits.

Also, read the book entitled- "The Mind and the Physical Body" by "Sir Charles Eckles". (Or- the Mind, brain and body") can't remember.

At the time he did his studies, he was an agnostic. Yet in conlusion of his book and research, he states this astounding observation- "the brain and physical body are just a machine, that a ghost can operate."

I pray this helps.

God Bless!!


Posted by: Samuel_W

very interesting, I have heard that the pagan religions of Old Testament times used to worship them as gods, this is backed up by some of the hieroglyphs found in ancient Sumerian cities that show people bowing down to giants.

I have never thought of them being aliens or UFOs, although i do think it is possible. I definatly believe in aliens (with so many sightings and reported abductions, i figure there is probably some truth to this)

I was at a website recently that said that the blood line of most of the European royalty can be traced back to the kings of these same ancient civilizations. The site hinted at the modern rulers of the world being nephilim blood... I dont know about this, it seems a little far fetched to me.... but thinking about it, it makes sense when the devil led Jesus into the desert and tempted him saying that he would give him all the kingdoms of the world... as if the devil were in charge of those who rule it? This is all speculation, I do find it very interesting tho. Also ties into the theory that the illuminate ( a secretive group of devil worshipers with lots of political influence) have been pulling the strings and are behind world events.

Any thoughts Commando?


Posted by: Christian Commando

Hey Samuel W-

If you were to look back into the historical records of all the major ancient Civilizations that were known in the world back in Old Test. times, and records that can be found thru archeological finds of many smaller races of people, you'd find all pagan groups or civilizations had some form of false gods they believed in.

Years of historical research into such things has proven one major point to me-

That God's Word was the first so called "religious doctrine" ever taught to man, and all others, are "spin offs from that. This includes not only doctrinal beliefs, but the false god(s) claimed to be followed. Why?

First, Satan is the father of all lies. Second- Satan, to this day, still wants to dethrone God in Heaven and be ruler over all creation. Thats why Satan is also known as the great imitator of God. Even to the extent of appearing as an "Angel of Light".

Some civilizations had gods that were "celestial"- (planetary) gods. Some had gods over the light, dark, and environment- (wind, rain, sun shine, etc). Some, had gods of trees, grass, animal life, etc. Others- life, death, fertility, destruction, advancement, etc.

The varieties are seemingly endless for this.

As to UFOs, the earliest most common belief of our Government when UFO sightings grew so fast and so many reported there for awhile was, they were secret aircraft the Russians or Germans had built we knew nothing about- (mostly during WW II).

But, after the war was over and we were involved in helping to rebuild those Countries devastated from war, we started getting reports from them, that showed they thought the same about the UFOs coming from us the same way.

But, no man made aircraft can be flying and be seen by radar, then just disappear. The latest advanced bomber we have- (unless a new design came out in last 2 years), cannot be picked up by radar at all because of its design. But, it don't have the capability to be seen by it, then disappear.

Our aircraft, be they commercial or miliitary, have turned in documented proof, as well as aircraft tower radar, of UFOs being detected, then just disappearing. And some military aircraft flew right thru where the UFOs were sighted seconds before. So, they hadn't just shielded thier presence, but just plain disappeared.

So, it has been realized, these aircraft are clearly not man made. My suggestion, as many of those Biblical Scholars who've studied this also believe, UFOs are "real", but not "physical". (In other words, spiritually convieved and made).

Hundreds of accounts speak of people being taken aboard these aircraft and thier bodies investigated by those entities. So, the aircraft are real, and just like Angels, can manifest themselves into physical form when appear on earth. Thus, I believe they can do the same with thier ships, as I do not believe they are made of any materials of this world.

And I have video and audio tapes, of bits and pieces of Governmental investigations that slipped out, showing paperwork and more, of test results from materials gathered from UFO crash sites, showing our instruments cannot recognize the type of metal or material parts, those aircraft are made of. (Project Twinkle, Project Blue Book and two other major Government studies on UFOs).

Yes, well, the "secretive groups"- Aluminati, Free Masons, Ba'ahai and a host of others, most times try to hide these days, the fact they believe such things to keep them more acceptable to people for believing them.

The ones I mentioned plus many others, all are tied into ancient civilization's religious beliefs and do follow or believe in false gods and or a "one world governing system" they are striving to achieve. And they are all secretively working in thier own ways, to try to achieve the above some day.

Tho the Ba'ahai religion is more out in the open about combining all existing religions, Christian and cult into one. Yet claiming to follow the one and only God of Heaven as a trinity, all the while backing false god teachings as well.

Modern Rulers being Nephilium- Nope, Maybe certain ones, but definitely not all. Anak and his Sons were rulers over Canaan, but thats why. It was derived from "Cain" who slew Abel. (Evil side as opposed to the good side as it were).

Being spiritual beings, they could've easily just left the earth and waited for the flood to subside as Noah did before re-appearing and settled in where they had.

Many could read historical Christian writings, to realize Canaan was considered the "land of milk and honey", because it was ruled over and cared for by mostly spiritual beings in physical human form. Hence the reason they were so huge, that normal humans were as "grasshoppers" in size compared to them.

Its clear as well, God had given His "Chosen" people discernment to tell the difference between the true human and spiritual beings. Besides the fact, look at the produce they brought back from that land, huge stuff.

The plant life was grown by a means that went far beyond this physical world means, which is why we never see, except on special occasion, a plant that will produce one or two melons, a pumpkin, etc that are way bigger than the others.

But, heres the point- Each person must do the research if want to learn and understand what the info will show them. I cannot say without doubt what I've spoken is absolute.

There are thousands of reports and documentations out there, and it comes down to God's conviction per person to decide what He wants them to understand from investigating it themselves.

The Forum of "Dreams and Visions" in the "Prophets Chambers" Room here is clear proof of that. Fact is, God can open up some things to one person, but may show a different understanding to another, from the identical info. Its what God opens up to each person what He wants them to see or understand.

Besides that, there are no guarantees my beliefs are fully accurate because of so many "missing pieces" to this whole puzzle. I only choose to believe as I do to this point, as the info uncovered so far, strongly suggests this as a very good, but most certainly not, "fully proven" synopsis.

God Bless!